Terry Savage: Chicken Money Is Still Tasty (From the Vault)

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Welcome to Fun with Annuities, where

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every single week I welcome a celebrity

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Let's get to it.

0:29
Welcome to Fun with Annuities. I'm your

0:30
host, Stan the Annuity Man. Uh, proud

0:33
and privileged to have a repeat guest on

0:36
our show. When you look up the words

0:38
consumer advocate in the dictionary, her

0:41
picture should be there because she was

0:43
actually a financial consumer advocate

0:45
before anyone started talking about

0:47
that. Her name is Terry Savage. Welcome,

0:50
Terry.

0:52
Thank you, Stan. Always good to be with

0:54
you.

0:54
Let's jump in. Let's uh let's let's skip

0:56
the formalities. We're good friends and

0:58
I'm dying to hear what you have to say.

1:00
At the time of this taping, we uh we're

1:03
not in Jackson Hole, Wyoming, but we

1:05
have been watching Jackson Hole, Wyoming

1:07
and the Fed. Um weigh in on all this

1:10
chaos, Miss Savage.

1:12
Well, finally, at last, at last, and it

1:14
doesn't matter what you say or what I

1:16
say, the stock market have had its say

1:18
today, up over 450 points to a new

1:21
all-time high. And just think, everybody

1:23
thought this was in the market. What

1:25
happened today, which by the time you

1:27
listen to this podcast, you'll probably

1:29
have heard, is that the Fed chairman

1:31
finally acknowledged that it was time to

1:34
start cutting rates. The time has come,

1:36
to quote him.

1:37
And um but even more so than that, he

1:40
took a victory lap. And I think in my

1:43
latest column, which I just posted at

1:45
terryavage.com, and it'll be syndicated

1:48
in your local newspaper in the week week

1:50
ahead. um he took a victory lap, a

1:53
well-deserved victory lap because

1:55
forever and ever in order to get

1:58
inflation cured. Think back to 1980

2:01
uh 8283

2:04
which was the most traumatic example.

2:05
The Fed had to jack up rates and then

2:08
create a humongous recession and throw a

2:12
lot of people out of work to cool the

2:14
demand that was pushing rates up. This

2:17
Fed board and this Fed chairman seem to

2:20
have managed to cool inflation. It's not

2:24
down to their 2% desired level yet, but

2:26
it's getting there. And it they have

2:29
done it without well, as the Fed

2:31
chairman said, yes, in unemployment is

2:34
up about 1%, but it's at 4.3%.

2:38
Which is still a very low rate. So, they

2:40
haven't thrown a lot of people out of

2:42
work. He explained that part of this was

2:44
more people coming into the labor force

2:46
that's helped them out. Um, so they've

2:49
done a cooling of the economy, a slowing

2:52
of inflation expectations. They did not

2:54
create a recession. Take a bow, Fed

2:58
chairman, for a soft landing, and

3:01
they're about ready to cut.

3:03
Hard question. the $800,000 uh $800,000

3:07
$800,000 job redo that just was

3:10
announced that our one of the cabinet

3:13
members or didn't even know existed,

3:15
which is kind of crazy. But when they

3:17
had to readjust that 800,000 800 I keep

3:20
saying dollar. I guess that's because

3:21
I'm in the dollar business.

3:22
It's money.

3:23
800,000 job readjustment. What was your

3:27
take on that? And it for the people that

3:29
don't know what I'm talking about, um

3:32
the government had to readjust the jobs

3:34
number by $800,000

3:37
again. $800,000, Terry. Um

3:40
I can real money.

3:41
I know. But te tell give me your give me

3:43
your take on this $800,000 number

3:45
because when I saw that, the conspiracy

3:48
theorist in my head was like, "Wait a

3:50
minute, that seems interesting timing."

3:54
numbers are always restated and and um

3:57
I I want I I wrote posted a column at

4:00
terry savage.com.

4:02
I want to point out how apolitical the

4:05
Fed is. I don't think the government is

4:07
really the one that um the labor

4:09
department which does the jobs numbers.

4:11
I don't think that was intentional.

4:13
There would be too many heads would

4:14
roll. But I want to give you this little

4:16
piece of research. Um the Fed always

4:19
says it's not political.

4:22
Um, the Fed always adjusts interest

4:26
rates despite

4:28
an upcoming election. And there's a JP

4:31
Morgan Chase article, uh, asset

4:34
management article that I I link to. Um,

4:37
and it says since 1980,

4:40
the Fed has either hiked or cut rates in

4:44
every single election year except in

4:47
2012. And by the way, if you don't

4:49
remember, back then rates were at zero.

4:51
and the economy was, you know, coming

4:53
out of the financial crisis. Otherwise,

4:55
the Fed cut rates in five election years

4:58
and hiked in five election years. Um,

5:03
and in some years there were more than

5:05
others. For instance, in 1980

5:07
they actually hiked once by 1% and cut

5:10
rates by five and a half% between

5:12
February and July. That was that

5:14
recession we were talking about. Um, so

5:17
I I think that we can count on the fact

5:20
that no matter what the politicians say

5:22
because there is obviously going to be a

5:24
rate cut coming that the Fed is

5:26
apolitical. History says they're

5:28
apolitical. They rely on the numbers.

5:30
We'll get another jobs number as you

5:32
point out in the next week. We'll have

5:34
another consumer price index number

5:36
before they announce that they have

5:38
their next meeting. But it's pretty

5:40
clear that there will be a rate cut. It

5:42
is not political. And I, you know, a lot

5:45
of the Fed's gotten a lot of bashing and

5:47
a lot of uh, you know, threats of of

5:50
controlling it and replacing the Fed

5:52
chairman and so forth. But I think if we

5:55
manage to slide through the end of the

5:57
year with inflation still staying down

6:00
at this level without a recession and

6:03
there, you know, the leading indicators

6:04
are a bunch of signs that the economy is

6:06
slowing, maybe even too much. We'll see.

6:09
But I think this Fed has done a just a

6:11
terrific job.

6:12
Interesting. And you and you have you've

6:15
known Fed chairman and and chair I mean

6:18
you chair people you I mean you talk to

6:20
them.

6:21
Yeah. Go go go back tell people your

6:23
credentials. Throw down the credentials

6:25
here.

6:25
Okay. But let's back up. I was um a

6:28
founding member and the first woman

6:29
trader on the Chicago Board Options

6:31
Exchange. That's a long long time ago.

6:33
And at the time the local TV station in

6:35
Chicago was looking for someone to

6:37
explain inflation and interest rates. I

6:39
feel like I I came through this movie

6:41
before and I still have a videotape of

6:43
me walking alongside Paul Vulkar who was

6:45
incredibly tall. I am not.

6:46
Paul Vulkar. He was like 68.

6:48
Yes.

6:49
Yes, he was. And I remember him saying

6:50
to me, "You really know these numbers,

6:52
don't you?" We were talking about the

6:54
money supply in those days. That's when

6:56
people first came to understand the

6:58
linkage between the creation of money

7:00
and inflation and inflation

7:02
expectations. So, I've been around this

7:05
game for a while and um I've seen Fed

7:07
chairman. I remember

7:10
uh Milton Friedman saying I see no

7:12
recession on the horizon. He was wrong.

7:14
I remember Ben Bernanki and helicopter

7:16
money and so forth.

7:17
Yeah,

7:18
I happen to think that um Jay Powell,

7:22
I'll give you a Jay Powell story. Back

7:24
in about 2012, you know, I just

7:26
mentioned that interest rates were

7:27
almost at zero. Do you remember that in

7:30
Europe um there were rates were actually

7:33
negative on euros and people were paying

7:36
the banks to hold their money. There was

7:38
so much concern

7:39
huge amount of negative interest rates

7:41
on bonds in Europe in the Euro zone.

7:44
So I was at a dinner where it was a

7:46
business dinner but questions were

7:48
allowed and as a journalist I've written

7:50
a syndicated column now for 35 years and

7:53
you can read my columns at

7:55
terryavage.com.

7:57
Um I I raised my hand right away. Jay

8:01
Powell was maybe 10 feet in front of me

8:03
and I said because T bill rates were

8:06
like a quarter less than a quarter of 1%

8:09
in the trading markets.

8:10
And I said, "Excuse me, Chairman Powell,

8:12
but do you foresee Treasury bill rates

8:15
going negative in the United States the

8:17
way rates have gone negative in Europe?"

8:20
I will never forget this. He fixated me

8:22
with the most stern grin and his

8:25
eyebrows grew together and he said, "We

8:28
will not have negative interest rates in

8:31
the United States." The way he said it

8:34
was literally chilling to me like he

8:35
alone and I think he did and we didn't

8:38
have negative rates.

8:40
Well, because I can't say the word jobs

8:41
and I keep saying the word dollars

8:43
instead of jobs. [laughter]

8:45
Um, you know, we're in a political

8:47
environment. You know, I always tell

8:48
people, red or blue, it's all green to

8:51
me. I don't really care. Either way,

8:54
we're going to survive as a country. We

8:56
just have to plan

8:58
um and we have to make those plans

9:00
regardless of who's going to be in

9:01
office. In your in your recent article,

9:04
you always mention chicken money and and

9:06
chicken money for Terry Savage, which I

9:09
hopefully she's trademarked. If not,

9:10
I'll trademark it for her on her behalf.

9:13
Um it's the money you don't want to

9:14
lose. It's that principal protection

9:16
money and what you mentioned in there

9:18
was chicken money. Even with rates, you

9:20
know, decreasing, it's still not a bad

9:23
play. Can you cover that?

9:25
Yeah. Well, you know, this all came

9:26
about many years ago when I was giving a

9:28
speech and I said, "The world's really

9:30
divided into the bulls and the bears.

9:32
Bulls think the market's going up. The

9:34
bears think it's going down. We're much

9:35
more savvy now than we were when I was

9:37
speaking to audiences back then." But I

9:38
said, I add a third category, the bulls,

9:41
the bears, and the chickens. And there's

9:43
nothing wrong with having chicken money.

9:45
And in fact, you should have some and

9:46
how much depends on your situation. Not

9:49
just how old you are, but how much money

9:51
you have, what your financial needs are,

9:54
and what your own personal risk

9:55
tolerance is, what lets you sleep at

9:58
night. So, you sort it out. But chicken

10:00
money by definition is money you cannot

10:02
afford to lose. And as such, it belongs

10:04
in things like short-term CDs, treasury

10:07
bills. Yeah, there's a column

10:08
upa munis

10:11
CD my treasury bills direct from the

10:14
Federal Reserve not through your broker

10:15
through Treasury direct the very very

10:18
safest things that let you sleep at

10:21
night. It it's as as the mantra of the

10:23
chicken money investor is I'm not

10:25
concerned about the return on my money

10:28
as I am about the return of my money. So

10:31
that's how you

10:31
Absolutely correct. No and I love

10:34
chicken money. I love it.

10:36
Yeah. Well, so here's what's happening.

10:38
Um, about two maybe two and a half,

10:41
three years ago, I started talking again

10:44
as I had in the 80s about Treasury bills

10:47
because the banks were very slow three

10:49
years ago to lift their rates on CDs.

10:51
Right

10:52
now, Treasury bills, let me just do a

10:54
101.

10:55
You have sophisticated audience, but

10:57
just in case, um, every the we have a

11:00
national debt, $34 trillion national

11:02
debt. Don't get me going there. We

11:04
borrow money and every Monday we have a

11:06
treasury auction of three and six month

11:09
IUS treasury bills billions of dollars

11:11
as old maturing ones come due and we

11:14
borrow more money. The rate at that

11:16
Monday auction midday is set by huge

11:19
institutions around the world, central

11:21
banks, huge institutions bidding. They

11:23
decide what the rate they would accept

11:25
based on the outlook for inflation,

11:27
what's going on in the US economy and

11:29
the rest of the world. And when you buy

11:30
T bills, you agree to accept that

11:32
average rate set at auction. Well, about

11:35
six, five, four, five, six months ago,

11:38
the sixmonth T bill yield, which you buy

11:41
at treasurydirect.gov, minimum $100.

11:44
This is not for just rich people,

11:46
right?

11:46
That rate was about 5 and a half% even a

11:49
little bit higher.

11:50
Uh now as we speak that rate is down

11:53
under 5%.

11:55
And because the Fed is obviously about

11:58
to cut rates, you will see and those

12:00
people who bought them T bills bought

12:02
themselves T bills four and five months

12:04
ago and said, "Oh, automatically renew

12:07
at whatever the auction rate is, that

12:09
auction yield will be lower in the

12:11
coming months." and the money that drops

12:13
down into your account in the form of

12:15
interest from your T bills will be

12:17
smaller.

12:19
Good point though, even if the T bill

12:21
rate for six months is like 4.8, maybe

12:24
four and three/4ers, we've still got

12:26
inflation down near 3%. So, you're still

12:28
making a pretty good deal for yourself.

12:30
Yep.

12:31
However, it will be less dollars in

12:33
interest earned, less dollars the

12:35
government will have to pay and that

12:36
will add to the national debt. But the

12:38
fact is tea bills, you buy them, you

12:40
roll them over automatically at maturity

12:43
and that's where your chicken money

12:44
goes. But those rates are coming down

12:47
and savers will have to be prepared. But

12:49
still not a bad deal when you consider

12:50
inflation is lower.

12:53
And I look at chicken money really

12:55
there's I think there's five products.

12:57
There's there's CDs, there's treasuries,

12:59
there's money markets, there's AAA

13:01
municipal bonds and then there's

13:03
multi-year guarantee annuities which the

13:05
annuity industry version of the CD. All

13:06
of those are principal protected.

13:08
Anything outside of that category, you

13:10
got to convince me why. And of course,

13:12
all of these come with different types

13:14
of maturities and different types of

13:15
rules. But I do think everyone needs

13:18
chicken money. I do want to pivot,

13:20
however, to the beloved stock market.

13:23
No, wait before you do that. Wait, wait,

13:25
wait. Before you do that, folks, by the

13:27
way, any of you who haven't watched me

13:29
on a podcast with Stan because I always

13:31
take what I learned from him and I do

13:33
every time and I I I I want to educate

13:37
my readers who are maybe not as you know

13:39
in daily newspapers around the country.

13:42
Stan multi-year guaranteed annuities.

13:45
I've never to be quite honest included

13:47
those in my chicken money.

13:49
You got

13:50
they are insurance country company

13:52
contracts.

13:53
Correct.

13:53
Okay. you know that all the banks have

13:55
short if you get a one-year CD it's FDIC

13:57
insured it's the same insurance whether

13:59
you buy from your local state bank or a

14:02
big well-known national bank okay

14:04
I I never included MAS and we we're

14:07
going to have a little discussion here

14:09
in my chicken money because number one

14:11
they're insurance company guarantees

14:14
which if an insurance company went under

14:16
that's only insured by a state guarantee

14:18
fund which does not exist we've talked

14:20
about that before so I'm going to ask

14:22
You explain why you think

14:26
first explain a miga.

14:28
Okay.

14:29
And then why you think that should fit

14:31
in chicken money

14:33
because the aspect of chicken money is

14:35
you get access to your money pretty

14:36
quickly in a money market deposit

14:38
account money market mutual fund T

14:40
bills. You're three or six months out

14:42
you can get your money. So why do migas

14:44
fit in that category?

14:45
They have to fit in that category

14:47
because number one they're principal

14:48
protection products. Number two they

14:49
they function just like CDs. The

14:51
difference is that and they can be held

14:53
in all types of accounts but the

14:54
difference is in a nonqualified nonIRRA

14:57
account that interest can grow

14:59
taxdeerred.

15:00
Uh with most migas you can there's

15:02
liquidity features. You can take out the

15:04
interest or you can take out 5% or 10%.

15:06
They're all different. If you go to my

15:08
site at theanuityman.com we have a live

15:10
feed for your specific state. But the

15:12
backing of the companies life insurance

15:14
companies issue annuities. They issue

15:17
these fixed annuities and there are

15:20
rules in place for these life insurance

15:22
companies to not be as dumb as banks.

15:24
They're not smarter than banks. They're

15:26
just more regulated than banks and they

15:28
have to have your money on hand 100% in

15:31
investment grade bonds day one. And most

15:34
of the time that we have seen uh a

15:37
company be absorbed by the state

15:39
guarantee fund. It's only happened a few

15:40
times since 2008. What typically happens

15:43
in the annuity world is another life

15:46
insurance company will come in and buy

15:48
that company up and the guarantees that

15:50
they have outstanding because annuity

15:53
products even migas are what I call

15:56
golden goose products. You cannot lose

15:58
confidence in them and the big companies

16:00
know that. Um but there are companies

16:03
the AAA trip you know the trip A+

16:05
companies that issue migas that if they

16:08
go out of business there's anarchy and

16:10
there's no power we're fighting each

16:12
other

16:13
we are at that point where I hope we

16:15
never have to know the difference of

16:17
these company I mean that would be a

16:18
crisis now tell me I'm turn the tables

16:20
because I get to interview everyone

16:22
absolutely

16:23
so if I said to you okay Terry just told

16:25
me that today probably next Monday's

16:28
auction um the six-month T bill will

16:30
yield 4.9%.

16:33
The interest gets paid up front, but I

16:34
don't declare it on my tax return to the

16:36
year of maturity. I don't pay any state

16:38
income taxes. That might be a

16:40
consideration. So, call it 4.9%. And

16:43
then I know I'll have to renew in six

16:45
months and the rate might be lower. So,

16:47
give me an alter what? Give me a

16:49
product. Tell me, let me give you a rule

16:52
on a double A company. What could I

16:55
what's the product you would sell me

16:56
instead of a TV? I'm not I'm not going

16:59
to spec specifically name a company or a

17:02
rate. What I'm going to tell you is the

17:04
rules that you have to have in place to

17:06
choose. I always tell people if you're

17:08
if your um target date for maturity is

17:11
less than three years. So that includes

17:13
3 months, 6 months up to two and a half

17:16
years, never buy a MIGA. But if you want

17:19
to lock in a guarantee past the

17:21
three-year time period, what you're

17:22
going to find is the MA is going to be

17:24
more competitive and have a higher

17:26
contractual guaranteed yield than a CD.

17:30
And the question, okay, Stan, why? And

17:32
the reason is life insurance companies

17:34
have many factors that they price off

17:36
of. Life insurance, that's very

17:38
profitable because they know when you're

17:39
going to die. Lifetime income products,

17:42
that's very profitable because they know

17:43
when you're going to die. legacy pro uh

17:47
bond portfolios that they've had in

17:49
place forever and then capacity you know

17:51
what they can bring in and guarantee and

17:54
typically multi-year guarantee annuity

17:56
companies because people say wait a

17:57
minute Stan why would this MIGA be

18:00
higher than a CD the four-year MA higher

18:02
than a four-year CD it's because the the

18:04
annuity company the life insurance

18:06
company that issues the annuity and this

18:08
is a kind of a broad rule if they can

18:10
make 50 basis points on the off the

18:12
money they'll give you let's just say

18:14
they'll give four% if they know they can

18:17
make three and a half on short-term

18:18
paper and all the other things involved

18:20
in pricing. That's the reason the

18:21
three-year and out rule is what I tell

18:23
my clients to look at. Obviously, we

18:25
look at claims paying ability of the

18:27
carrier, but we really haven't seen a

18:29
lot of disruption in the MA space. One

18:33
more thing, Terry, that I want people to

18:35
understand. When if if people are out

18:38
there and they think that taxes are

18:40
really going to go up and they don't

18:41
want to pay taxes on their interest, the

18:44
good part about a MIGA in a nonIRRA

18:46
account, and yes, you can have them in

18:48
an IRA account or Roth, but let's just

18:49
talk about non-qualified money. If you

18:52
don't want to pay taxes on that

18:53
interest, you can let it defer

18:56
or you could just

18:57
you take it out or you could take it out

19:00
when you need it. In other words, look

19:02
at a MA interest like a light switch.

19:06
Okay? You can flip it on and off when

19:08
you want, but let's just give you an

19:09
example. Let's just say they go, "Okay,

19:11
all you evil rich people with MAS out

19:13
there, we're going to tax that interest

19:14
rate at 90%." I'm just bringing that as

19:16
an example. Then don't take it.

19:19
All right. Wait, let me stop you. Let me

19:20
stop you with people wondering what I

19:22
was doing. This is my phone and here's

19:24
what you can do. I went on CNBC.com

19:27
and in the top is the markets and I

19:28
looked at bonds and I do this all the

19:30
time and right now we you talked about

19:33
okay not less than three years. I want

19:34
to make that very clear. Chicken money

19:36
has shortterm very shortterm access but

19:40
not a MIGA because there probably are

19:41
penalties and so forth. But now let's

19:43
compare apples to apples. I'm looking as

19:45
we speak

19:46
at the five-year US Treasury uh rate. It

19:50
trades in the multi-t trillion dollar

19:52
treasury market all day long and then at

19:54
one month there'll be a two-year note

19:56
auction or a sevenyear or fiveyear

19:57
whatever. So as we talk a fiveyear note

20:00
a fiveyear treasury US treasury is

20:03
yielding 3.64%.

20:06
On a fivey year

20:07
on a fiveyear that's that's I mean I'm

20:09
looking at the real market.

20:10
That's great.

20:11
So if I called you up today and said

20:14
Stan,

20:15
and again this will be different when

20:16
you hear this, but I'm talking about

20:18
today is the day that Jay Powell said,

20:20
"Yeah, we're going to cut rates." So So

20:22
uh actually rates are down. The yields

20:24
are down a little bit. They were close

20:27
to 3.7%

20:28
yesterday at this time, but but today

20:30
it's 3.64. So, if I call you up today

20:34
and say, "You're gonna give me like a CD

20:37
thing where I don't have to pay taxes

20:40
until I take it out at the end and I

20:42
could keep rolling it over

20:43
and you're going to give me a guaranteed

20:45
rate guaranteed by a double A plus PL

20:48
insurance company. So, I'm not waking up

20:50
in the middle of the night. I'm pretty

20:51
well locked in for five years, but I

20:53
would be more or less in a treasury.

20:55
What's the yield I could get on my MA?"

20:57
I'm not going to give a specific year

20:59
because think but but let's just say

21:01
it's 100 to 150 basis points higher

21:03
typically. Okay.

21:04
You said today you could get me four and

21:06
a Yeah, you could. But here's the thing.

21:10
But it's not as static as that. Terry,

21:12
don't make it that static.

21:14
If someone calls us and say I'm deciding

21:17
between a Treasury and a MOA,

21:19
then I'm going to say how big is the

21:22
safety factor to you? And if they say

21:24
that's all it is, and I'm going to say

21:26
buy the treasury

21:28
because

21:28
buy the treasure because it's the safest

21:30
money on the planet.

21:31
Period.

21:32
Is it 75 basis points or 100 basis

21:34
points safer than the MA from the

21:36
insurance company for the same five

21:38
years?

21:40
It depends on the person. You can't just

21:42
say you buy you always buy the MIGA

21:44
because it's higher. It's going to be

21:46
higher, but you're going to have to feel

21:48
comfortable with the claims paying

21:50
ability of that carrier and state

21:52
guarantee funds, whatever, however you

21:53
want to frame that. But I want the MGA

21:57
and we put and we put this in our

21:58
chicken money. It's just part of the

22:00
five chicken money categories. Again,

22:02
CDs, money markets, treasuries, munis.

22:06
Okay, you've done what I wanted to do. I

22:08
think I'll write another column about my

22:10
because all of a sudden the rate gap is

22:12
very interesting. Yeah. But here's what

22:14
I'm saying to all of you. If you buy a

22:17
six-month Treasury bill, by the way, you

22:19
have to wait from Treasury Direct. You

22:21
have to wait until it matures. You want

22:22
maturities instantaneous because your

22:24
kids's going to college or you might

22:26
need to pay buy a new car in three

22:28
weeks. Then you put it in a money market

22:30
fund. You can buy a Treasury only money

22:32
market fund. That's instant access.

22:34
Treasury bill get three and six month

22:36
access. Decide your maturities, stagger

22:38
them. MA you've got if I

22:40
MA has instant access too with a lot of

22:42
them.

22:43
Well, some allow loans, right? But you

22:46
you're going to get a higher rate there.

22:48
But again, the chicken money definition,

22:50
I'm not so concerned about the return on

22:52
my money. It's the return of my money. I

22:54
have no hesitation, Stan, in having my

22:57
chicken money in tea bills. But for also

23:00
what I call chicken money about

23:02
principal risk. I have no hesitation

23:04
about putting a portion of that in a

23:06
MIGA, but that's a longer term

23:08
commitment, a little bit less liquid and

23:11
a teeny little bit. Please God, we never

23:13
have to differentiate between safety of

23:15
the Treasury printing all the money it

23:17
needs and

23:18
there's no different there. Listen,

23:20
okay,

23:20
if the TR the Treasury is the gold

23:23
standard of safety, all the conspiracy

23:25
theories theory people can email me, but

23:28
I'm telling you that's as good as it

23:30
gets. And then underneath that um you

23:33
can argue it's it's FDIC or SIPC and

23:36
underneath that you can say AAA insured

23:39
insured municipal bonds if you want to

23:41
argue that I would say out of all of

23:44
those and we're talking about treasury

23:45
CDs money markets AAA munis and then MAS

23:49
I would put MIA as number five ranked

23:52
from a safety standpoint within the

23:54
chicken money but has to be in the

23:55
chicken money because it protects your

23:57
principle and there's the demographic

24:00
title wave of people that are looking to

24:01
say that that what I always tell people

24:04
if you won the game why are you still

24:05
playing that have enough money that they

24:07
just want to peel off the interest when

24:09
needed then then do the chicken money

24:12
strategy

24:13
another key thing there's you know let's

24:15
talk about by the way I know your

24:18
listeners I I know all of you out there

24:20
I hear from my email is terry

24:22
terryavage.com so

24:24
and she responds she responds she gets a

24:26
bunch

24:27
and I have an ask terry blog at

24:28
terryavage com and I stay up late

24:30
answering this question. I respect the

24:32
fact that the audience for this podcast

24:34
is pretty sophisticated, but you just

24:36
made an important point I want to go

24:38
back to.

24:39
There are some people who have chicken

24:41
money because they're older, they're

24:44
retired, they're not working anymore,

24:46
and this is all they've got and they're

24:49
just hoping to make their money last as

24:50
long as they do. I'll talk to you about

24:52
the stock market and it over the long

24:54
run and I'm a true believer. I have been

24:56
for all these years since my early

24:58
trading days on the floor of the CBOE.

25:01
But for some people, the chicken money

25:02
is

25:04
if you don't have this, it's it's you

25:06
know, you shorten your lifespan by

25:07
having a heart attack because you just

25:09
do not want to lose it. And a lot of

25:10
people are exposed to stock market risk

25:12
in their retirement that they don't even

25:14
understand. We could talk about

25:15
targeting. That is correct. All these

25:17
con games that people don't understand

25:19
the true risk.

25:21
So, but your audience, you're right, is

25:23
special. So when I talk to chicken

25:25
money, I'm trying to reassure people who

25:27
just want to keep it safe. It's all they

25:29
have. They may be younger. A woman just

25:31
got divorced. She got this much money.

25:33
That's right.

25:34
Yeah. Over the long run, she should be

25:35
invested in an IRA or something, but

25:37
right now she cannot lose that $27,500

25:41
that goes in a money market account.

25:43
Now, all of you people out there have

25:45
different choices to make. I think your

25:47
audience is people who a pretty darn

25:50
sure at this stage that they have enough

25:52
or will have enough to be able to retire

25:54
and continue to live comfortably are

25:56
many are concerned with I'm just going

25:58
to pass what am I going to pass on to my

26:00
children or grandchildren

26:02
and that category of safety becomes a

26:04
little bit different a little teeny bit

26:06
more risk that you could take in terms

26:08
of earning more because this is not your

26:11
last penny so let's sort out chicken

26:13
money um for the chickens that are

26:15
really pecking away at the last few

26:16
grains there and they have to keep it

26:18
safer and shorter.

26:19
Well, and I think chicken money

26:21
dovetales into the other thing that I

26:23
preach about is income floor. You have

26:25
to have an income floor in place so that

26:27
you don't disrupt your investments. I

26:29
think the 4% rule is dead. I think it

26:31
doesn't hold water from a factual

26:33
standpoint. Wade foul has destroyed it

26:36
factually in books, which is and the 4%

26:38
rule for people that don't know this.

26:40
Put all your money in the market and

26:41
just take out 4% in gains when you need

26:43
it. Well, that's fantastic in a in a

26:44
raging bull market, but if you have a

26:46
couple of bad years, it's tough. I

26:48
always tell people, you already own the

26:49
best annuity on the planet, social

26:51
security. Build from that with

26:53
guarantees, whether it's a lifetime

26:54
income annuity or the chicken money

26:56
where you protect your principal and

26:58
just take interest, so that you can hit

27:00
those annual or those monthly bills

27:03
without disrupting any type of growth

27:05
investments if you choose to do growth

27:07
investments. But I think going forward

27:09
into where we're headed, regardless of

27:12
who wins the election, doesn't matter.

27:14
We're It doesn't matter. We're going I

27:16
know people are yelling at me, but trust

27:19
bear with me.

27:20
You have to plan for either either party

27:24
winning. You have to plan for it. And

27:26
the interesting part about that, I need

27:28
you to weigh in on this, is regardless

27:30
of who wins, they're all going to be

27:32
dealing with the same financial mess.

27:35
and they're all going to have to do

27:37
things that you can plan around whether

27:39
they do this, then you plan for this,

27:41
but I think now is the time not to watch

27:43
the bad ads and the debate and and all

27:46
this stuff and the pundits on TV. The

27:48
time is now to plan. Okay, if this

27:50
person wins, this is probably going to

27:52
happen. I'm going to plan for that. If

27:53
this person wins, this is probably going

27:55
to happen. I need to plan for that.

27:57
which dovetales into the stock market

28:00
and I am absolutely dying to hear your

28:03
thoughts on this this rolling train down

28:07
the track that we're seeing.

28:09
Well, this is very interesting what's

28:11
going on. Now, I I also put in a recent

28:13
column some stock market history. Um,

28:16
you know, we look at a lot of indicators

28:18
that work for a while and don't work for

28:20
a while and a 67% track record is, you

28:23
know, putting some odds on your side.

28:25
Here's one stock market indicator that

28:27
has an 87% success record over the last

28:32
nearly 100 years. And that is

28:36
if the stock market gains in the three

28:40
months preceding a presidential

28:42
election, which is to say August,

28:45
September, and October. If the stock

28:48
market is higher,

28:51
just leave it at that. a simple thing

28:52
like that. 87% of the time the incumbent

28:56
party stays in power.

28:59
Interesting.

29:00
So, you know, we've had some interesting

29:02
days. We had that thousand point down

29:04
day. We've had the stock market

29:06
rallying. Uh there's a reason I started

29:09
our discussion today with the Fed being

29:11
apolitical because they do move during

29:13
election years and half the time they

29:15
move up and half the time they move down

29:17
and it's it's not political. Okay,

29:19
conspiracy theorists, you can have your

29:21
say, but that's just, you know, JP

29:24
Morgan asset management statist. You can

29:27
find that at terryavage.com.

29:29
Scroll down under my columns and about

29:31
the fourth one down now is is the Fed

29:33
political. So, you can read it for

29:35
yourself. So, the fact is that we're

29:38
having the stock market tell us some

29:39
very interesting things these days. And

29:42
uh we will h have to see. Now, I'm gonna

29:46
disagree. I'm going to say something

29:48
that's controversial. I tend to avoid

29:50
politics.

29:51
Okay.

29:52
In my discussion and I'm but

29:54
particularly now when you said it

29:57
doesn't matter who wins in the sense of

30:00
the markets and the economy. I agree

30:03
with you more this this time around than

30:07
ever. I think this election despite

30:11
labels of left and right and we're going

30:14
to cut taxes for the rich or the middle

30:17
class. I think this is going to be a

30:20
really pivotal election based on a whole

30:23
lot of other things that are very

30:26
important to many Americans.

30:28
Sure.

30:29
And I think that economic policy you I

30:33
go way back to when James Carville was

30:35
in Clinton. You know, it's the economy

30:36
stupid. Well, the economy is doing

30:39
reasonably well. I mean, we're growing.

30:42
We haven't had a recession. Uh GDP is

30:44
growing at 2% at least. For a lot of

30:46
people, it's not.

30:48
I understand that completely. But the

30:51
fact of the matter is I don't think the

30:53
economy per se is the issue this

30:56
election. Now, what you were right,

30:59
whenever we get to the end of this, you

31:01
know, next February 1st when we're okay,

31:04
it's done. It's done and let's go

31:05
forward.

31:07
We have some big issues and we will have

31:09
a new Congress.

31:11
Yep.

31:11
And that those elections are just, I

31:13
think, equally important. not equally

31:15
but very very important this year

31:17
because there will be big things to deal

31:19
with. Now you know that my co-author who

31:22
I really have you had Larry Katikov on

31:24
your podcast.

31:24
Oh absolutely. He's been on the he's

31:27
been on the podcast and for people that

31:28
don't know he ran for president. Smart

31:30
smart guy. Smart guy.

31:31
He's so smart. He he's going to win a

31:33
Nobel Prize. He wrote the book Getors

31:36
from Social Security. And he and I wrote

31:37
a book uh last year called Social

31:39
Security Horror Stories about the $21

31:42
billion in clawbacks because Social

31:44
Security is such an accounting mess that

31:46
they paid people that they now think

31:48
they shouldn't have. There's no statute

31:50
of limitations. We are meeting with the

31:52
Social Security Commissioner. We have it

31:53
on the books. He has um we were on 60

31:56
minutes and he referred our book into 60

31:59
minutes. Uh he's limited club XEX to 10%

32:01
but a lot of disabled people are just

32:03
getting taken off the rolls and getting

32:05
multi,000 bills. Oh way back during the

32:08
pandemic you worked an extra three

32:10
months and made more than the limit. So

32:12
we want all the money back. We pay

32:13
you're Yeah. You're still disabled but

32:15
you were over the limit for three

32:16
months. Give it all back. We are working

32:18
to get that changed.

32:19
Yeah. Larry Cot Lov just like it sounds.

32:22
Type it in. Yeah. I've done a podcast

32:24
with him and you can find his stuff with

32:26
Terry as well. like she said, she's been

32:28
on 60 Minutes with him. Just a really

32:31
interesting, smart guy with a big heart

32:33
that's applying his his brain to the

32:36
betterment of society, just like Terry's

32:38
been doing for the past 40 plus years.

32:40
Um, but yeah, very interesting person

32:43
that is not accepting the social

32:46
security um answers at face, you know,

32:51
he's got software, by the way. Maximize

32:53
my social security.

32:54
Absolutely. It's great. Before you go

32:56
claim or decide should my husband do

32:58
this, should I came on my spouse's

33:00
benefit and then switch da da da da age

33:03
70 or 67 or I take it early. Go to

33:05
maximizemysocial securitycurity.com pay

33:08
$50. They will give you the correct

33:11
answer because nine times out of 10

33:13
social security will give you the wrong

33:14
answer, mislead you and cost you a

33:16
lifetime of benefits.

33:17
And your advisor your advisor doesn't

33:20
know. Don't ask your advisor social

33:22
security claiming qu. If you asked me a

33:25
social security claiming question, I'd

33:27
be like, "You got to be kidding me. I

33:29
have I mean, I' I'd rather you ask me

33:30
how are rainbows made?" No, you you

33:33
How do we get here? Oh, I know how

33:34
[laughter] we got here. We got here

33:36
because I was about to say Social

33:38
Security is a big thing for me now. We

33:39
have a website, Social Security Horror

33:41
Stories. We have the book and

33:43
everything. We are actively working

33:44
every day to get the mess that it is.

33:47
And the new commissioner, I must say,

33:49
Commissioner Martin Ali, um, is doing a

33:52
great job of trying to whip these people

33:54
into shape. But you have thousands of

33:55
agents, depending on who you get on the

33:57
phone, capable of granting waiverss on

33:59
these clawbacks. They have no no the no

34:02
adult supervision. Don't get me started.

34:04
But the [laughter] point is that's a

34:08
current problem that Larry and I are

34:09
making a dent in. It makes me feel good.

34:11
Good. But the real problem is that

34:14
social security is a really significant

34:17
part of the income of of millions of

34:20
Americans. The

34:21
vast majority of people, the vast

34:23
majority,

34:24
more than half of the people who get

34:26
social security rely on it for at least

34:28
twothirds of their retirement income. So

34:31
it's this is the truly the net. And we

34:34
know I mean you this is not a political

34:36
question. We know the actuaries say that

34:40
we're getting within 10 years of the

34:42
moment where the money coming in from

34:44
the people working won't be enough to

34:46
pay the benefits we've promised. Okay?

34:49
So, how do they deal with that? You

34:50
can't reduce social security check for

34:52
someone's grandma who doesn't have

34:54
anything. So, this next Congress will

34:57
have the last best chance to deal with

35:00
social security. And nobody's talking

35:03
about that.

35:04
Nobody's talking about any entitlements.

35:07
We're going to do this. We're going to

35:08
But social security is just it's a

35:11
number. Larry's the expert on it that he

35:13
says that it's 75 trillion and they

35:15
don't calculate beyond a few years.

35:17
Correct.

35:18
The fact is the next Congress, both

35:21
Republicans and Democrats are going to

35:23
have to deal with it. And what are they

35:24
going to have to deal with? Waging

35:26
raising the cap. Okay. Why should uh

35:30
people who earn more not pay the tax? I

35:33
know that's you. That's Larry. That's

35:34
your audience. I mean,

35:36
but but the fact is we talked about what

35:40
would happen if the insurance companies

35:41
collapsed or something like that. Social

35:43
Security is just about as unthinkable as

35:46
that.

35:46
So either they print the money and

35:48
what's that called? Inflation. There you

35:50
are Zimbabwe with what 892% inflation.

35:53
You just can't print money. they have to

35:55
come up with actuarial

35:58
um ways of dealing with social security

36:00
and we are on the cusp of that. So when

36:03
you say to me

36:05
to everybody and you're right don't

36:07
listen to the pundits and the economics

36:10
and the platforms that's baloney.

36:12
They're going to have to come face to

36:14
face with a bunch of financial crisis.

36:16
Growth will solve the problem of the

36:18
deficit. political action or compromise

36:21
of some sort will solve the problem of

36:23
social security or at least push it off.

36:25
And the next Congress is not going to

36:28
have the luxury of not to mention all

36:31
the many other issues that we face as

36:33
Americans. The next Congress is not

36:35
going to have the luxury of debating

36:38
what's going on in the political world

36:39
today in my mind.

36:41
And I I want to tell people out there,

36:42
my clients, nonclients, people that tune

36:44
in because they saw Terry Savage's name,

36:46
solve for your problem. Okay? Everyone's

36:49
problem is unique. You know, the pundits

36:52
talk about the financial pundits talk

36:54
about, you know, things from a 30,000

36:56
foot view. That's not you. You

36:58
everything is customizable to your

37:00
situation. Um, period, you know, and

37:03
I've been on the other side of the desk.

37:05
I worked with Morgan Stanley, UBS. I

37:07
work for them. I worked for Dean Witter

37:09
and Payne Weber back in the day. So,

37:10
I've been on that side of the desk.

37:12
Annuities don't solve for everything.

37:14
Millie saw for four things. Principal

37:16
protection, income for life, legacy, and

37:18
long-term care. Never ever ever buy an

37:20
annuity for market growth. regardless of

37:22
that really good steak you ate at the

37:24
seminar, but because it's not designed

37:27
for that and you never should should buy

37:29
it for that. Terry, do you think the

37:32
artificial intelligence and that wave of

37:35
technology that had a little bit of a

37:37
hiccup recently, do you think that our

37:40
continual drive as a country to be

37:43
better and be more innovative, is that

37:45
pushing the markets? What what's

37:48
happening here?

37:49
Do you think the internet changed

37:52
everything?

37:53
Darn too.

37:54
35 years ago, I was writing a weekly

37:55
column and I faxed it in.

37:58
Do they even make faxes anymore?

38:00
I know. Nobody has a fax anymore. It's

38:02
hysterical. I don't I mean, who has a

38:03
fax? Um, just before earlier today, I

38:08
was listening to something on the news

38:09
or something like that, a local. And um

38:12
and they are now going to use artificial

38:15
intelligence to read colonoscopies. are

38:18
working on the gradients and the scales

38:20
to help spot anomalies and help

38:24
physicians and radiologists spot

38:26
anomalies. Do you think the way the

38:28
internet changed the world? It's hard to

38:31
think back before, but we're old enough

38:32
to remember. Sure.

38:34
I mean, I remember when remote controls

38:36
happened on TV, that's how old I am, you

38:38
know, and I think that changed the world

38:40
at the time. I I got one of the first

38:42
car phones ever because I I don't know.

38:45
It just

38:46
I had one of those that was that was

38:47
huge.

38:48
It was big. Yeah.

38:50
By the way, remote control for all the

38:51
people, this will make them laugh. My

38:53
dad had a remote control and you're

38:54
like, "Really?" Yeah. It was me. He'd

38:56
tell me go turn the channel.

38:59
So, I was always getting up and down.

39:00
Turn the channel.

39:02
There were only three or four channels.

39:03
So, we were just proving world. What I'm

39:05
trying to say is [laughter] that we, you

39:08
know, you've been through cassettes and

39:10
Atrex and now it's on your phone.

39:12
Blu-ray disc. I've got a I've got a

39:14
really good deal on some Blu-ray disc

39:16
for you, Terry.

39:16
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You might at an

39:19
antiques fair. Get something for us.

39:21
Look, um,

39:23
that's what's exciting. That's what's

39:25
exciting about a free enterprise

39:26
economy. That's what's exciting about

39:28
America. the fact that great minds get a

39:31
chance to develop new things that'll

39:33
help uh medicine and help consumers and

39:36
just change our lives. And that's why

39:38
you always have to be open. You always

39:40
have to be investing.

39:41
That that's what the stock market, a

39:43
diversified portfolio gives you, not the

39:45
hot stock of who's going to find, but

39:47
there we're finding cures for for

39:49
medical issues. Uh I think the cancer

39:52
moonshot is whether it becomes under

39:54
Biden's um presidency or down the road.

39:58
I I you know we look back and think

40:00
hundred years ago they were still

40:01
putting leeches on people to you know to

40:04
cure them. I I think there are just so

40:06
many wonderful things that are coming

40:08
down the road that will be investments

40:10
for all of us. And what our job is is to

40:13
keep the free markets alive

40:16
and and rewarded

40:18
um within boundaries of of uh full

40:22
disclosure and equity. So I I'm just a a

40:26
real cheerleader for America and I think

40:27
we're beginning to understand the

40:30
opportunities ahead of us. So when you

40:31
ask about AI, I you know I'd love to be

40:33
around to see all the things that does

40:35
and I'm not afraid of robots, you know,

40:36
coming in.

40:38
Well, and and in in the political tribal

40:40
environments that we're in, I want to

40:42
remind people that this is a great

40:44
country and it is unmatched. And I was

40:47
talking to someone this morning. I said,

40:49
"If there was a" and he he mentioned his

40:51
his tribal policy, the tribal group he

40:54
was a part of. I said, "Okay, so you're

40:56
red or blue. If the opposite person was

40:59
standing beside you and you totally

41:00
disagreed with them politically and

41:02
you're standing on the street corner and

41:03
they got attacked randomly, would you

41:05
stand up for them and fight for them?"

41:07
He said, "Absolutely." I said, "Exactly.

41:09
We got to get back to that as a country.

41:11
We all 911 showed that we all are in

41:15
this. We're all in together. Okay. And

41:17
I'm hoping that we can go toward that.

41:20
And I know you guys are out there

41:21
saying, "Stan, you're getting sappy and

41:22
you're going to cry." And no, I'm not.

41:24
I'm just saying we forget the

41:27
opportunities that this country

41:29
provides. Someone like myself, someone

41:31
like you that that knocked the door down

41:34
and then took a hammer and beat the

41:36
glass ceiling into pieces uh to get on

41:39
this the Chicago board of options.

41:42
That's insane. But that's fantastic. in

41:44
a country like this. I really wish that

41:48
and I'm I know I'm hoping that

41:49
politicians would talk like that more

41:52
instead of getting personal and putting

41:53
each other down. I don't know how we

41:55
went got to that and the consultants

41:57
that tell them that work, but it doesn't

41:59
work on me, you know? I'm looking for

42:01
people's ideas, whether it's in the

42:03
private sector, the public sector. I

42:05
don't really care. I just want to hear

42:07
ideas. I want to hear people thinking.

42:10
Um, I want IQ. Uh, when I'm turning on

42:13
the television, which is now hard to

42:14
find, I I want IQ. That's the reason I

42:17
think I think that entrepreneurs and and

42:21
people that are involved in technology,

42:24
they've tuned all that out. They're

42:26
going forward with their ideas, hopes,

42:27
and dreams. And that's the reason I

42:29
think you see the stock market where

42:30
it's at. My opinion.

42:33
Well, you know what? I happen to agree

42:34
with you perfectly. Maybe that's the

42:35
right place to end it. But let me let me

42:38
say a couple of things. you you made a

42:40
very good point about that. No matter

42:42
what, you're still going to have to

42:44
manage your own money and your own um

42:48
future, your own income in retirement.

42:51
That's the goal. Um to have enough to

42:55
generate income and then leave some to

42:56
your family. [snorts] So, I happen to

42:58
think this is a per a perfect time to do

43:02
some financial planning of your own with

43:06
someone sophisticated

43:08
and someone you can trust.

43:10
Um, and I just let me just say this. I

43:14
sell nothing. I have no clients. I've

43:16
never gotten a penny from endorsing a

43:18
product or service. I My brand is Terry

43:21
Savage. The Savage Truth on Money.

43:23
That's the title of my most recent book,

43:24
which the fourth edition of, is now a

43:26
couple years old. And um my goal is to

43:29
introduce people to places where they

43:32
can get trusted financial advice. I'm

43:36
going to come to you last, but let me

43:37
give you some of those places. Um, I

43:41
think the most important thing in

43:43
evaluating a financial planner is that

43:46
it be a fiduciary

43:49
and a fiduciary who fully discloses all

43:52
costs and preferably a fee only

43:56
fiduciary.

43:57
Not feebased.

43:59
Pardon?

44:00
Not feebased.

44:01
Not feebased. Fee only. They're not

44:04
competing for a trip to uh you know Bora

44:07
Bora Hawaii or whatever else it is based

44:10
on the number of units they sell of this

44:12
that or the other.

44:13
They're not getting a trailing

44:14
commission.

44:16
So my good friend now and my

44:18
co-podcaster and you've been on our

44:20
friends talk money podcast Krueger

44:22
created something called wealth ramp

44:25
wealthr.com

44:27
which is like match.com for fee only

44:29
fiduciary advisors. There's number one.

44:33
Number two, Larry Kloakov. You're gonna

44:34
have to have him back. I've just posted

44:36
a new article.

44:37
Yeah, I need to I need

44:38
He called out Fidelity and you can find

44:41
it on his Substack uh blog, Kotloff,

44:44
Larry Kotoff. He called out Fidelity's

44:47
financial planning in his most recent

44:49
pod blog that I I want to send a copy of

44:54
that and the column I've just posted on

44:56
terryage.com

44:57
about his maxify planner masplanner.com

45:03
which is economicsbased financial

45:05
planning. You need to have him on to

45:07
talk about that. It's something you can

45:09
do yourself

45:10
very inexpensively. They will help you

45:12
through it. They do it. They have

45:14
financial planners that license this

45:16
software, but he just called out

45:18
Fidelity and Vanguard and every other

45:21
big for giving misleading planning

45:23
advice that's not based on economics.

45:26
This is going to be the next big blow up

45:28
here. So,

45:29
I agree with that. I think the financial

45:31
industry is going to change definitely.

45:33
I think and then I do believe first of

45:36
all I have annuity money that drops into

45:39
my checking account on a regular basis

45:42
and it can you see me smile when I say

45:45
it because it always comes as a surprise

45:49
a delightful surprise and in fact um

45:53
I I didn't really under I I bought these

45:56
annuities back when because I was trying

45:58
to understand them well enough to write

46:00
about and I didn't want to write about

46:01
something that I wouldn't do myself and

46:03
here I am all these years later and the

46:05
money's coming. So I believe in

46:08
annuities in their place in your

46:10
portfolio

46:11
for some not all.

46:12
Pardon?

46:13
For some people not all.

46:15
No for in their place in your portfolio.

46:17
Sure.

46:17
And I cannot tell you Stan will tell

46:20
this is true because on my ask Terry

46:22
blog I get these questions. I got talked

46:25
into this thing. I don't know what it is

46:26
and I go you know what I can't diagnose

46:29
this but go to stantheanuityman.com.

46:32
set up an appointment and you can trust

46:35
the advice he gives you. So when I talk

46:37
about getting trusted advice, I get

46:39
nothing out of that, nothing out of

46:41
these recommendations.

46:42
But there's so much misleading

46:44
information out there.

46:46
It's terrible

46:46
from some very well-known names. That's

46:49
how they get all the money to run the

46:51
ads and the commercials that build the

46:52
big buildings.

46:54
So my brand is the Savage Truth and I

46:57
and I welcome you at terryavage.com.

46:59
Post your questions. If you write about

47:00
an annuity, the odds are if I don't know

47:02
the answer right off the bat, That's

47:04
right.

47:04
I will copy it and send it to Stan and

47:06
say, "Help me answer this reader." That

47:08
will

47:08
We're the only site,

47:10
and you know, we're licensed in all 50

47:12
states. We're the only site that has a a

47:14
place where you can click it for second

47:15
opinions is if you've either bought

47:18
something or been pitched something and

47:19
you just want a second opinion on it,

47:21
we'll give it to you. We're not going to

47:23
try to sell you something. We're going

47:24
to give you either what the facts about

47:26
what you own. That's been a gamecher

47:29
because people want they just want to

47:31
know. I tell people all the time, if you

47:33
can't explain it to a nine-year-old,

47:35
don't buy it. No offense to the

47:36
nine-year-olds. You know, Warren

47:38
Buffett, who you know and have videos on

47:40
your site with. Yes, Terry. And Warren

47:43
Buffett. I mean, if he doesn't

47:44
understand it, he doesn't buy it. I

47:46
don't know why people want to make it so

47:48
difficult.

47:50
Understand what you're doing. Take your

47:52
time. There's no urgency to buy or make

47:55
a move. If someone's ma trying to make

47:58
you

47:59
sign the paper, you're going to miss out

48:00
on this and that, then walk away.

48:02
Period. Been doing this for 30 years.

48:04
Terry's been doing this for 40 plus.

48:06
Listen, there's no urgency. The only

48:09
urgency is for you to understand what

48:10
you're doing.

48:11
Exactly. And get good advice before you

48:13
do it. Believe me, you don't want to be

48:14
funding their retirement. You want to be

48:16
funding yours. That's a savage truth.

48:18
Terry Savage, it's so great to catch up

48:20
with you. You know, we haven't seen each

48:22
other like face to face and dinner for

48:24
years. That has to change one of these

48:26
days. Our our lyricists have to meet on

48:29
the tarmac, right? [laughter]

48:34
We don't talk Florida. Okay.

48:36
Well, listen, take care. Thank you so

48:38
much and thanks everybody for joining

48:40
Fun with Annuity. See you next time.

48:44
[music]