Jack Lenenberg: Long Term Care & Rising Interest Rates

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[Music]

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welcome to fund with annuities where

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every single week I welcome a celebrity

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guest expert that can help you maximize

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chapter 2 of your life listen learn

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laugh and love every minute of the most

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unique Financial podcast on the planet

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let's get to

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[Music]

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it welcome to fun with annuities I'm

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your host Stan the annuity man America's

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annuity agent licens in all 50 states I

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am so happy to have a repeat guest

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personal friend and the absolute Guru

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go-to person expert in the field of

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long-term care in addition to that he

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does have his law degree but don't hold

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it against him because he is a straight

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shooter just like I am that's the reason

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I refer all of my long-term care

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business to him until he retires so

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please don't retire his name is Jack

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Jack linenberg hello Jack hi Stan how

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are you I'm good man by the way for all

1:07
the listeners out there going long-term

1:09
care yes exactly long-term care um and

1:13
Jack has forgotten more than most

1:16
long-term care agents will ever know and

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this is all he does and he does it very

1:20
well and he's he's National like I am

1:23
and we'll have this on on our site where

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you can go but his site is

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www

1:30
LTC partner p a r t n

1:34
r.com www LTC

1:38
partner.com and you can schedule a call

1:42
get a quote all that stuff but um he's

1:46
the man and speaking of that Jack I

1:49
think we should talk about our current

1:52
issues with parents right because Jack

1:55
and I have been trying to do this

1:57
podcast for a while and um um he's doing

2:01
some caregiving with his 86 year old

2:03
father my mom is 84 and a handful to say

2:07
the least and um you know these are

2:12
these are moments that I I'm sure a lot

2:14
of the people listening and viewing this

2:16
are saying yeah I'm kind of going that

2:18
through that with my parents either if

2:20
you're not taking care of them but

2:21
monitoring them which dovetails into the

2:23
whole long-term care give us some um

2:28
reality lights I was going to say

2:29
highlights but reality lights of what

2:31
you've been dealing with here recently

2:33
Jack is it's a

2:34
handful it and it absolutely is I mean

2:38
so the last I will say that this

2:41
actually not just with my father but

2:43
with my my wife and I we have starting

2:46
about a year ago a little over a year

2:49
ago with her

2:52
mother um she started

2:56
to mildly become cognitively

3:00
impaired um last summer and you know my

3:05
wife and my sister-in-law were taking

3:08
turns to go to

3:09
Florida um to help her to stay with her

3:14
at home make sure that she was safe uh

3:17
manage her medications Etc but while

3:19
they were going back and forth when they

3:21
couldn't get there of course we were

3:23
bringing in Round the Clock home care

3:27
for my mother-in-law you know and that

3:29
that lasted through this past spring

3:34
when we finally made the decision that

3:36
you know we needed to relocate her from

3:38
Florida to you know to

3:41
Georgia so that she could be near us and

3:44
we placed her in a beautiful assisted

3:46
living

3:47
facility

3:49
um right about at this time my

3:52
father had a fall in Pennsylvania at

3:57
home um this was was in

4:00
April and I read the I received the call

4:03
from his wife um that he was in the

4:06
hospital

4:08
so I flew in the next day my father has

4:12
Parkinson's um it turned out he had been

4:16
in the hospital for over a

4:18
week before his wife called me great

4:23
over a week and it also turned out that

4:26
I discovered he had hid this from me for

4:29
years

4:31
his wife has

4:33
dementia so that's why I never got a

4:35
phone

4:36
call um so for the past six months he

4:40
was in the hospital for three months

4:42
with Parkinson's he couldn't

4:45
swallow um we had to make a decision do

4:48
we put a feeding tube in him you know to

4:51
get him nutrition to keep him alive uh

4:54
we waited two and a half months to have

4:56
the

4:57
surgery had the surgery the next day he

5:00
pulls out his feeding tube

5:02
stand had to have a second

5:05
surgery so fast forward to today you

5:09
know I he's he's in a nursing

5:12
home um and I'm going into Pittsburgh

5:15
you know typically uh every you know

5:18
three weeks to make sure he's okay

5:21
monitor the situation right um and

5:24
actually now I'm I'm trying to assist

5:26
his

5:28
wife that get placed in a nursing home

5:31
her herself cuz she can't live alone

5:34
either so

5:36
it's it's a lot last it's a lot I mean

5:40
it's it's a lot it's

5:42
just you know in the last year we've

5:44
placed my mother-in-law and assist of

5:46
living and you know relative to my

5:48
father she's doing great right you know

5:51
um but my father you know and now my I

5:54
guess my stepmother you know in nursing

5:56
homes so it's uh

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yeah it's it's it it's it's a lot you

6:04
know emotionally and

6:07
uh well and and uh I always tell people

6:11
there's three phases of retirement

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there's go go then there's SLO and then

6:17
there's

6:17
noo and you know we're all if we're

6:20
fortunate enough to get to the third one

6:22
that's great but it ain't

6:24
fun um and I always tell my mom who's

6:27
who's 84 years old getting ready to be

6:29
85 she lives in St Augustine Florida

6:31
she's very active the only thing that's

6:34
going to probably take her out is either

6:36
Dementia or falling you know falling is

6:38
a big one and she she falls a lot but

6:41
doesn't tell me until I see the bruises

6:43
and her or her friends tell me but one

6:45
of the things that I just value our our

6:49
friendship and Business Partnership

6:51
relationship however you want to call it

6:53
referral nness is that my mom is always

6:56
asking me the question should I keep my

6:58
long-term care

7:00
stay which I didn't sell her I don't

7:03
sell long-term care I said yes of course

7:05
you do yes you do you're transferring

7:08
the risk for that coverage whether you

7:09
need it or not and what I like about

7:12
Jack is he talks about the three types

7:14
of long-term care that's available which

7:17
right now I think the most popular types

7:20
are asset based meaning you're not

7:22
losing the money the money's not going

7:24
down the rabbit hole like the

7:25
traditional long-term care but I think

7:28
the story the reason we LED with these

7:30
stories is because of our parents is a

7:33
lot of you are in those same life

7:35
stages and you want to make sure that

7:37
your kids aren't having to do things

7:40
that they don't have to do and if you

7:41
want and if you can prepare early for

7:45
long-term care that's great so we're

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going to go through like we always do

7:49
with Jack the types and then we're going

7:52
to talk about current environment Etc

7:53
but quickly Jack can you go through the

7:55
types of long-term care that um you

8:00
offer and show and recommend if it's

8:03
suitable and you know so keep it simple

8:06
there's there's really let's just say

8:07
there's two types of policies we have

8:11
long-term care insurance what's all you

8:13
know Standalone traditional long-term

8:16
care

8:17
insurance um use it or lose it coverage

8:21
works just like your your health

8:23
insurance your auto insurance your

8:26
homeowners insurance you own a policy

8:29
and if you happen to need long-term

8:31
care if you become chronically ill the

8:34
company will pay you

8:36
benefits you will stop paying

8:39
premiums you know just insurance for

8:42
health this is the hardest one to get

8:44
right because the underr underwriting is

8:46
is the way I understand it the

8:47
underwriting is more significant because

8:50
you're not lump summing it you're paying

8:52
into it correct well I will say this I

8:55
mean it's

8:58
it's I it it is the hard the hardest to

9:01
get only because the arena is limited we

9:05
have five Underwriters left in the arena

9:08
and that's

9:09
it and as part in the country in the

9:12
country correct there's five companies

9:14
left now with traditional long-term care

9:17
insurance all five Underwriters have a

9:21
requirement to order medical

9:23
records so the reason I think it's I

9:26
mean it's harder to get because they

9:27
will always order medical records no

9:30
matter what you have a telephone

9:31
interview and medical

9:34
records and the more records that an

9:37
underwriter gets to review your health

9:40
history well the less likely it may be

9:43
that you will be approved for coverage

9:45
right um but that's the traditional

9:48
long-term care insurance no cash value

9:52
premiums are not

9:54
guaranteed and yes it can be the hardest

9:58
to be under just because they will

10:00
always get medical records the second

10:03
type of policy as you've mentioned

10:05
already Stan the asset based

10:07
Arena um now asset based can cover

10:11
either policies where the asset is a

10:13
life insurance policy or where the asset

10:16
is an annuity okay let's stop right

10:20
there for a second okay life insurance

10:22
companies issue annuities those are life

10:25
insurance products when we go into

10:27
long-term care that is a health

10:30
insurance product okay so there's a lot

10:33
of misinformation out there at the bad

10:35
chicken dinner expensive steak dinner

10:37
seminar that they're saying hey I've got

10:39
this index in new with an income riter

10:40
and covers for long-term care that is

10:42
absolutely categorically and factually

10:45
false

10:47
go well so to keep the asset based Arena

10:51
simple how you know our clients should

10:54
view these products Visa the traditional

10:57
products is they've really morphed into

11:01
a fixed

11:03
cost return of Premium long-term care

11:07
policy so let me say that again fixed

11:09
costs your premiums cannot change unlike

11:12
the the Standalone policies where the

11:15
premiums are not guaranteed right and a

11:18
return of Premium if you do not need

11:20
care so the money that you're paying for

11:24
the policy if you do not need Care at

11:27
death you receive essentially your money

11:31
back um whether it's the annuity cash

11:34
value or whether it's the life insurance

11:36
death benefit it's essentially a return

11:39
of

11:40
Premium long-term care policy with

11:43
guaranteed costs so yes these have

11:47
become

11:48
the most popular way to plan for

11:52
long-term care

11:54
today um the underwriting is easier in

11:59
the sense that you have a telephone

12:01
interview but if they like what they

12:04
hear you can be approved without the

12:07
ordering of medical records so that's

12:09
why it's it's easier in the sense that

12:11
you can control the narrative and I mean

12:14
we want you to be clients to be honest

12:17
and reveal everything Etc sure but it

12:20
goes without saying that if if they like

12:23
the story after the interview you will

12:25
be approved without ordering medical

12:28
records and having an underwriter

12:30
stumble upon something that maybe you

12:32
didn't know about Etc so the yeah the

12:35
underwriting is easier to to get the

12:37
asset based policies for sure with the

12:40
demographic tiway that me and you are

12:42
both in which is the 12,000 plus Baby

12:45
Boomers hitting 65 every single day have

12:49
you seen a a rush for coverage or a rush

12:55
for an analysis of coverage they already

12:57
have he have you seen things pick up

13:00
just based upon who we are as a country

13:02
and the H the fact that we're aging yes

13:04
I mean for there's a number of factors

13:07
that are playing into it now but yes the

13:10
Baby

13:11
Boomers now are caring for aging parents

13:14
I mean they're in our situation and it's

13:17
a our situation right this is what this

13:19
is where we are at right now you know

13:22
our parents mid 80s later 80s needing

13:26
care y um that the caregiving of our

13:30
parents is what is the Catalyst for all

13:33
the

13:34
planning that we're doing now I mean

13:37
because listen I started in this

13:40
business then I was 30 years old you're

13:42
like 35 now right yeah but I mean so so

13:46
I was 30 how long have you been doing

13:47
this Jack how long have you been doing

13:49
20 you know 20 seven years now so

13:54
27 years okay so you know while I knew

13:59
everything about the products the

14:02
contracts the underwriting I had all the

14:04
analytical knowledge you know at 30 35

14:08
40 45 but I did not

14:11
have what I have today which is actually

14:14
managing the care of parents and going

14:17
through it personally and

14:20
it's you know it it's it's it puts a

14:24
different spin on it and you know when

14:27
when we took out our policy she's my

14:29
wife and I I mean the the reason we did

14:31
it you know we didn't want to have to

14:33
burden our children with these issues y

14:37
you know when we're in our 80s and they

14:40
have their own lives that was our

14:42
motivating factor when we did

14:45
it even though we still had not lived

14:48
through it ourselves but now that we're

14:50
actually living through it it's CR it's

14:53
crystallized it I mean I am just

14:57
so happy

15:00
that we have our coverage already in

15:02
force and paid for

15:05
and

15:07
um but yeah so so you know today with

15:10
the Baby Boomers experiencing this with

15:12
their parents it's created a lot of

15:17
interest in long-term care

15:19
planning uh for certain I mean my phone

15:21
rings off the hook I know I know we so

15:25
treasure you helping our clients for

15:27
sure tell us about rates I mean the FED

15:30
keeps keeps bumping and we have 33

15:32
trillion in debt and it's not

15:34
sustainable but we're at 20year highs

15:37
how's that played into your world Jack I

15:39
mean and and and so that's the other

15:41
issue just as far as you know recency in

15:45
the last 12 to 18

15:47
months so in the long-term care Arena

15:51
the interest rates Drive the pricing of

15:54
the policies right low interest rate

15:57
environment higher

16:00
premiums because the companies get less

16:03
money when interest rates are low from

16:05
the premium that you write to the

16:07
insurance company so they have to raise

16:08
costs sure in the past 18 months and

16:13
specifically even in the past say eight

16:15
or nine months we have had pricing

16:20
decreases on these policies specifically

16:24
the asset-based policies

16:27
25% decrease costs

16:31
today with a number of companies versus

16:34
January of this year

16:36
25% so we're getting just a lot of

16:40
interest now with where the pricing is

16:43
too where it's the policies look very

16:48
very very attractive from a value

16:50
standpoint today with a higher interest

16:53
rates um the asset based annuities

16:57
they're they're paying 5% % yeah on cash

17:00
values today as well so even in with

17:03
that subset

17:05
5% the the cost of a long-term care you

17:09
know the morbidity cost inside a

17:11
long-term care annuity is about 2% a

17:14
year you know three years ago the

17:17
interest rates weren't covering the cost

17:19
of insurance now now yeah now

17:23
3% right so the policies you know have

17:28
extreme value just relative you know to

17:32
to the benefits that that consumers are

17:34
receiving today for sure by the way

17:36
we're talking to Jack linenberg he is

17:39
the president CEO founder of the in fact

17:42
in my opinion the number one source for

17:44
everything long-term care he is the guy

17:47
as you just told you 27 years of

17:49
experience in the long-term care Arena

17:51
his website is LTC partner that's a

17:54
singular not Partners partner LTC

17:58
partner partner.com I'd encourage you to

18:00
go there and talk with Jack if you've

18:02
ever talked with me he's nicer than me

18:05
but as brutally factual how about that

18:08
um but he he's fantastic and we've been

18:10
referring people to him and I've yet to

18:12
hear someone say anything

18:14
negative um you know people people

18:17
sometimes Jack don't get my loving

18:19
abrasiveness sometimes when I talk to

18:21
people but it is what it

18:24
is what's the future of long-term care

18:26
Jack are we going to see more carriers

18:31
more products or is it going to be a

18:33
slow bleed

18:35
dwindling a good question Stan and I

18:39
would like to hope that we

18:42
will have new Under Riders enter the

18:46
arena I do know there is one underwriter

18:49
that is is bringing a new you know

18:51
product a new product for them sometime

18:54
in

18:55
2024 it's also in the asset-based arena

18:58
so

18:59
OB the AET based Arena will increase in

19:02
Underwriters for sure the traditional

19:06
Arena will bleed a slow death and so so

19:11
that's what you know we're going to see

19:13
the separation continue okay um and the

19:17
traditional long-term care for those

19:18
people out there that's when you buy the

19:20
long-term care you put monthly premiums

19:22
in

19:23
ETC um and then if you don't use it you

19:26
you know use it or lose it as Jack said

19:28
but you know I think the would you say

19:30
the vast

19:31
majority of policies sold today are

19:34
asset based 100% I mean to go back to my

19:38
point about the rate decreases that we

19:40
had in the arena

19:43
25% okay they were only on the asset

19:45
base side the traditional

19:47
Underwriters which increased premiums by

19:50
35% in 200 19 and 20 have yet to move

19:55
back

19:56
down so you know it just tells you

20:00
that I mean from they just don't have

20:05
you know the market share anymore

20:07
they're not getting the business the

20:09
premiums so certainly I think the the

20:13
traditional side five years from now I I

20:17
think it will be completely dead so as

20:20
the song goes Jack the future's so

20:23
bright I have to wear shades you're not

20:25
wearing Shades but are your glasses

20:27
tinted do you see a bright future for

20:29
long-term

20:30
care I see I mean I certainly see a

20:33
future um and I would say it's bright in

20:36
this

20:37
regard you know if in fact we are moving

20:39
to the asset base space where premiums

20:42
are guaranteed to

20:45
me that's a win you know it's a win for

20:49
consumers if all the policies have

20:51
guaranteed fixed premiums and we cannot

20:54
get a rate increase if a company has

20:56
poor claims experience so so that to me

20:59
is a bright future uh in that regard we

21:02
don't have to manage rate increases

21:05
anymore where clients have had policies

21:08
for 10 or 15 years and then the

21:10
insurance company sends a letter

21:12
requesting more money um so I I can see

21:17
it being bright in in that

21:19
regard

21:21
um you know would I like to have more

21:23
Underwriters enter the arena sure uh but

21:27
the underwriters that we do have are all

21:29
A+ A++

21:31
rated you know so they're all solvent

21:34
and highly rated so the underwriters we

21:37
have in the arena right now are the

21:38
companies you want backing the

21:41
business right in in that regard

21:44
represents everybody just letting he's

21:45
got no skin in the game with any of

21:47
these people he's just he's just finding

21:49
the best policy with the best claims

21:51
paying and Care ability carrier and he

21:52
matches you up with that after shopping

21:54
all carriers so he's not beholden to to

21:58
one is just like me I think I know the

22:01
answer this question I'm going to ask

22:02
because there a lot of people out there

22:03
that ask me this question about timing

22:07
it can I time it Jack can I can I find

22:10
The Sweet Spot for long-term care

22:12
purchasing I'm assuming the answer is no

22:15
correct me if I'm wrong the answer is

22:19
no um the best timing to obtain coverage

22:24
is when you are concerned about plan

22:28
long-term care right when you do not

22:31
want to burden your family with these

22:33
issues and when you have the resources

22:35
yep to be able to fund a plan and if

22:39
you're healthy enough to get a policy

22:41
and you have the resources yes I mean by

22:43
all means that is the perfect time to

22:46
buy your coverage you cannot

22:50
wait until the accident has happened to

22:53
try to throw on your seat belt you

22:55
cannot call me nice right after you've

22:59
had a visit to your

23:01
doctor and try to get coverage it will

23:04
not work it just does not work that way

23:07
you can't wait for the perfect

23:09
day to buy a policy after you've been

23:13
diagnosed with a chronic illness and you

23:15
have to come forward with everything you

23:18
can't hold back they know they're going

23:22
they're going to know there's they all

23:24
do electronic prescription drug reports

23:27
they know every medication that

23:29
everyone's been prescribed in you know

23:32
in five years so we can't hide anything

23:36
right so you can't say Jack I was taking

23:39
the blood pressure medicine because it

23:41
helped me exercise

23:43
better yeah no it's the soon the sooner

23:47
everybody plans the better stand it goes

23:49
without saying yeah you're transferring

23:52
risk I mean you're transferring risk to

23:56
the long-term care carrier to to absorb

23:58
that risk similar to if you're buying a

24:00
lifetime income annuity you're

24:02
transferring risk to that annuity

24:03
Company to pay for as long as you are

24:06
breathing so I think the timing issue I

24:09
think people have a hard time Jack when

24:11
they go to People Like Us that are

24:13
selling contractual guarantees because

24:16
they come from an investment world of

24:17
timing things trying to find a sweet

24:19
spot trying to find an Arbitrage moment

24:23
that they can beat them right we're

24:25
always looking to win we're winner

24:27
winning Society United States but as

24:30
Jack says winning is transferring the

24:32
risk winning is is getting that coverage

24:35
winning is being able to pay for that

24:38
coverage um and it's a different mindset

24:41
I tell people that all the time it's

24:42
just a different mindset there is loss

24:44
of opportunity you're not going to buy

24:46
the next Tesla and the next Google or

24:48
whatever the stock of dour is today but

24:52
you are taking care of things and what I

24:54
call checking the boxes and long term

24:58
care is a checking of the boxes one

25:00
thing's on my mind Jack and I don't know

25:01
if what your opinion is because no one

25:03
has the future in in front of

25:06
them do you see a future where the

25:09
Obamacare type coverage

25:13
will either

25:16
invade um aggressively the long-term

25:19
care space or and or take it

25:21
over um here's what's happening so

25:24
that's a great question of course it is

25:26
I asked it yeah this is what we're so so

25:29
by Obamacare I'm going to say the

25:31
government getting involved in in

25:33
long-term care right and it is happening

25:36
and here's how it's happening

25:39
okay all right

25:41
2021 we had the first state the state of

25:46
Washington has a

25:50
longterm care payroll

25:53
tax what Washington did was they said

25:57
we're going to tax every employee in our

26:00
state 610 of 1% of income to

26:06
fund long-term care for the mass

26:09
washingtonians exactly and so in

26:13
2021 everyone who resided in Washington

26:17
were were calling

26:18
me because there was an opt out

26:21
provision if you buy long-term care

26:23
insurance privately you won't pay the

26:25
tax and when he says everyone he's not

26:29
kidding I remember that time

26:31
unbelievable the whole state is like so

26:35
35 40 45 year olds all the the Boeing

26:39
Employees and the Micosoft Engineers are

26:41
calling me to buy

26:43
coverage not really because they thought

26:45
they wanted to do long-term care

26:47
planning at age 35 or 40 they just

26:49
wanted out of they didn't want to be

26:51
taxed they didn't want the state to tax

26:54
their income to pay for future care of

26:57
residents right so that was

26:59
2021 Washington

27:02
now here's where we are at today 12 more

27:06
states are

27:08
exploring pay only 12 oh it's G to end

27:12
up being 50 but right now we have 12

27:15
more that have plans I mean some of them

27:17
off the top of my head California is

27:19
next by the way California is next year

27:23
G um Michigan Oregon North Carolina

27:27
Pennsylvania Hawaii uh Colorado

27:32
Minnesota so you need need to add more

27:35
phone lines Jack I'm just letting you

27:36
know it's a business here's

27:38
what so here's what California is doing

27:41
Washington 610 of 1% yeah California

27:46
lovely State 2% progressive tax of 2% of

27:51
income ah

27:54
two% ah I know for all you all you

27:58
people saying you rich people can afford

28:00
it trust me they're going after

28:02
everybody okay but here's the here's the

28:05
bottom line this is what people need to

28:06
know if they are employees of these

28:08
states with payroll tax what the state

28:11
is providing to the employees for what

28:15
they are being taxed is peanuts so

28:19
Washington was given one year of

28:22
benefits 3,000 a month a

28:25
$36,000 long-term care plan

28:28
which is nothing no

28:30
$36,000 for all the

28:32
residents who need care who are invested

28:35
in the plan and all of the employees are

28:38
being taxed to subsidize the cost of a

28:43
$36,000 policy um

28:48
California is looking at a little bit

28:51
more comprehensive coverage but 2% of

28:54
income

28:56
wow for what you will have to pay in

28:59
taxes if you live in California or in

29:01
one of these states you can get so much

29:03
more coverage privately than what the

29:07
state is going to give you more exitus

29:11
out of these states their people are

29:14
going to leave the

29:16
states well the states just want to

29:19
incentivize people to plan for long-term

29:21
care that's what they want they the

29:23
Medicaid doesn't have the money to pay

29:25
for it I understand

29:27
yeah so but there's a there's a reaction

29:29
to the action that's right that's right

29:32
but if if if there

29:34
are you know residents of these states

29:37
that are faced with a payroll tax you

29:40
know my advice just is explore your

29:42
options you will almost certainly do

29:44
better outside of

29:46
whatever uh money the state will provide

29:50
in the form of a public benefit yeah

29:53
doubt always do better always do better

29:55
privately no doubt no doubt about wow so

29:58
next the next couple years GNA your

30:00
phone's ringing off the hook get you

30:01
need to get a headset Jack well I the

30:05
you know what happened in Washington is

30:06
that the Insurance Underwriters refused

30:08
to sell them policies after about 45

30:11
days I remember that it was a complete

30:13
prop poish show because that's right

30:16
because they received too many

30:18
applications and the uh the underwriting

30:22
departments were throttled with a

30:24
bottleneck so I mean certainly for

30:26
California right now it would behoove

30:30
everyone in California who does not want

30:32
to be subject to a payroll tax to

30:35
actually just go ahead and get coverage

30:38
so that they can opt out before the

30:40
insurance

30:41
companies sh you know shut off theet

30:44
shut it down that's called skating to

30:46
where the Puck's going to be instead of

30:48
skating behind the puck I.E GNE gresky

30:50
but this is a long-term care ring Wayne

30:53
grety analogy got

30:56
another hot question for you Jack

30:58
lenberg Jack linenberg long-term carep

31:00
partner.com but it's not long-term care

31:03
spelled out it's

31:04
LTC partner.com he's the guy he's the

31:08
number one in my opinion the number one

31:09
expert in long-term care on this planet

31:14
and if you want to argue with that then

31:15
bring it on I think I'm going to win the

31:18
question

31:20
Jack how much money do I need to have to

31:23
self- ensure is there such a thing is

31:26
there such a thing Jack

31:28
lenur

31:31
well I mean right now my father's

31:33
nursing home costs are 12,000 a

31:37
month his wife's memory care cost will

31:40
be 12,000 a month 13,000 maybe for her

31:44
it's 25,000 a

31:48
month so the question is you tell me

31:51
right I mean that that's that's today

31:54
right let's say let's say you're a

31:57
couple that's 60 years old and you're 25

31:59
years

32:00
away and nursing home Care's 12,000

32:04
today it's

32:06
35,000 a

32:08
month for nursing home in in 25

32:12
years it's a big number Stan I mean it's

32:16
it's a big

32:17
number um in full disclosure Jack did

32:21
the factual backhand to me he didn't

32:24
literally hit me but he did the factual

32:26
backhand to me

32:27
because for a long long time I was under

32:29
the assumption and I'm not going to give

32:30
away the multiple millions of dollars

32:32
that I would say is the bogey for

32:34
self-insurance and then Jack ran the

32:36
numbers he says St don't say that

32:38
because everyone's different there's not

32:40
a solution or a bogey or number it

32:43
really comes down to running that

32:45
$122,000 a month number or what it will

32:47
be down the road and if that makes sense

32:51
if you live for three or five years

32:52
that's a big big big big big number and

32:56
just like we buy home insurance fire

32:58
insurance car

32:59
insurance Florida flood insurance hello

33:03
hurricane

33:04
Insurance you know it's nice to have it

33:07
right yeah and and you know the the

33:10
earlier the people plan the better stand

33:13
I mean so think a quick example let's

33:16
say a couple is is is in their

33:19
50s you know and if they could set

33:23
aside couple

33:25
hundred, in a policy

33:29
today when they're

33:31
85 that could give them $200,000 could

33:35
be leveraging into about two and a half

33:37
million of coverage at age 85 for a 50y

33:40
old couple today of guaranteed benefits

33:43
so it's like a a 12 to one leverage play

33:47
right just remember what Jack said

33:49
earlier in an asset B asset based policy

33:54
that 200,000 is not going anywhere right

33:58
I mean you're not losing it it's not

33:59
going down the rabbit hole it's not one

34:01
think well I'm not going to do that

34:03
thing is the long-term care company

34:05
keeps the money no what he's saying is

34:09
you can leverage it control it and the

34:11
family gets it if you don't use it right

34:15
so it's you

34:17
know we could move $200,000 turn it into

34:20
two and a half million and if care is

34:22
not needed you get the two $200,000 back

34:26
you know so

34:28
it's and people can put in as much or as

34:31
little money as they want but the

34:32
Leverage is is still there

34:36
so it makes sense I think what people

34:39
today most people underestimate the

34:42
actual cost of care today oh gosh these

34:44
are just big numbers

34:47
today um no doubt care costs per month

34:51
so can people

34:53
self-insure sure a lot of people can

34:56
it's just that you mentioned is that the

34:57
best use

34:59
of what you've worked for and saved you

35:02
know to to go through it all at the end

35:06
I mean there there can be better ways to

35:08
do this I'm happy about my policy yeah

35:12
exactly are there capacity issues with

35:14
these carriers I mean do can

35:17
they is there a limit to what they take

35:20
is there

35:21
um I know that you talked about earlier

35:24
when Washington did what they did and

35:25
what California's getting ready to what

35:27
they do what they do Etc these carries

35:28
are going to be

35:30
overwhelmed well okay so is there is

35:33
there a time that they go no noas noas

35:36
foxing analogy by the way I mean so so

35:40
the only time they've ever done that was

35:42
the state of Washington and in candidly

35:45
that was because they received hundreds

35:48
of thousands of

35:50
applications and they didn't have the

35:53
resources to process it and also what

35:56
the the state residents were asking

35:58
for you know wasn't conducive to running

36:01
business most people said I want to buy

36:03
the minimum amount of coverage to get

36:04
out of a payroll tax it was just a

36:06
unique situation outside of that issue

36:10
arising again no they have the

36:13
capacity um okay the companies will

36:16
allow anyone to purchase anywhere from

36:19
in benefits 2,000 to 20,000 a month so

36:23
most people can

36:25
find you know a comfortable amount of

36:28
coverage minimum to maximum with any

36:31
company um so no I don't I don't think

36:34
that they will they will issue what

36:37
people want if people are healthy enough

36:39
to qualify for

36:41
coverage you know so do you think the

36:43
long-term care industry has done a good

36:47
job

36:50
educating the

36:55
public

36:58
probably

37:00
not probably not um I agree I mean I

37:06
agree

37:07
totally no I I

37:11
think it's not the largest Arena right

37:14
to begin with um neither is the annuity

37:17
space but they the annuity has done a

37:19
bad bad job of that as well I think that

37:23
I'm just Jack I'm I'm think you bizar we

37:26
could have double Zar offices it could

37:28
be a joining so we could watch sports

37:30
but you being the Anu the long-term

37:33
carar IB the annuities are things would

37:35
change because I think people would

37:37
fully understand and they need to what

37:39
is what is out there because there's a

37:41
lot of misconceptions Etc do you see

37:44
blowback from the planners of the world

37:47
and the raas of the world with long-term

37:49
care are they becoming more open to this

37:52
as part of the portfolio as they

37:54
should I'm are open

37:57
um there is you know I I see a lot of

38:01
bad guidance from a lot of financial

38:04
advisors on a daily basis I see a lot of

38:08
Amen to that poor advice from a lot of

38:11
financial planners on a daily

38:14
basis

38:17
um my dut instinct is a lot of financial

38:25
planners they may not be knowledgeable

38:28
with long-term care insurance per se and

38:31
I think if a financial planner does not

38:35
have the requisite knowledge about a

38:39
product it's easier to

38:42
say don't buy it you can

38:44
self-insure right and avoid the

38:48
conversation than

38:50
rather you know giving proper guidance

38:54
to their clientele

38:57
um I agree with that that's well well

39:00
put well put and I and I think also part

39:03
of it could be that sometimes financial

39:06
advisors don't know what they don't know

39:08
because maybe they haven't been

39:11
caregivers yet they don't have the scar

39:13
for their parents right so so without

39:17
the experience they might not know

39:20
everything that it

39:22
entails both from an emotional

39:24
standpoint and a monetary standpoint

39:27
and I I think the default also is if

39:30
they don't have the knowledge and a lot

39:33
of my clients who come to me and work

39:35
with me they tell me all the time that

39:37
their financial advisors couldn't answer

39:39
any of their questions so that that

39:40
leads me to believe that they they just

39:43
don't know the products they don't they

39:45
they're not familiar with it it's not

39:47
what they

39:48
do um so yes I think if it's not what

39:52
they do then it's easier to say tell

39:54
their clients don't do anything yeah I

39:56
mean run into the same thing all

39:57
annuities are bad all annuities are

39:59
expensive never buy an annuity you

40:01
already own one player it's called

40:04
social security security you know come

40:06
on so don't be a hypocrite but I I think

40:09
that um you know be like me commenting

40:11
on balet you don't want that Jack

40:13
because I don't know anything about it

40:15
let's talk about the process a little

40:16
bit I I mean just from a 30,000 foot

40:19
Jack linenberg ltcp partner.com

40:24
view um

40:27
start to finish on non-asset-based and

40:30
then asset-based products if if someone

40:32
says yep Jack ready to roll let's do

40:34
this thing what do you seeing ballpark

40:38
time framewise start to

40:41
finish um the time of this taping look

40:44
at the date please all right we'll start

40:47
with the policies that most people

40:49
aren't buying traditional policies okay

40:51
four to six weeks telephone Health

40:54
interview Medical records will be

40:57
ordered so it just takes two to four

41:00
weeks to get the records in house and

41:02
then reviewed another five to 10

41:04
business days so six- week process got

41:08
it easily easily on a standalone

41:12
policy on an asset-based

41:16
policy telephone Health interview so if

41:19
I complete an application for my client

41:21
today they immediately get a link to

41:23
schedule the interview they can have it

41:25
done

41:26
in three or four days from there three

41:29
to five business days it can be reviewed

41:34
policy can be approved easily within 10

41:37
to 14 days after speaking with me and

41:41
issue that's fantastic and people need

41:44
to know that if you haven't caught it

41:45
yet just by the Cadence when Jack and I

41:47
talk I mean we're not hammers looking

41:50
for nails I mean we're not close close

41:52
close close close close we're not those

41:54
people I mean we're trying to to solve

41:58
the problem if it needs to be solved and

41:59
we are very secure enough with ourselves

42:03
to say you don't need it or you don't

42:04
qualify for it or this isn't the right

42:07
time or

42:09
whatever

42:10
[Music]

42:11
um what are some just general things

42:14
Health are there this might be a bad

42:16
question so smack me down are there any

42:19
General Health Care issues that would

42:22
just preemptively from the get-go

42:26
disqualify someone for looking at

42:29
long-term care coverage of any

42:32
type in the get-go like automatic

42:36
[Music]

42:38
Knockouts memory

42:40
loss okay you know any diagnosis of of

42:44
you know early onset Alzheimer's or you

42:47
know again

42:49
Parkinson's

42:51
um

42:53
osteoporosis with a fracture

42:56
is an automatic knockout you know if

42:59
anyone's been diagnosed with that okay

43:01
interesting

43:04
um multiple sclerosis automatic knock I

43:08
mean I have a whole underwriting but but

43:10
what you're going to do when someone

43:11
calls is you're going to ask basic

43:13
questions you've been to the rodeo

43:15
before um the long-term care Rodeo

43:18
you're going to tell people hey I just

43:20
don't think this will go through or hey

43:23
I'll give this a shot because I am Jack

43:25
Lon ber I am Mr long-term care it is you

43:28
know I will do the best I can but it

43:31
might not go through you gauge

43:33
expectations going in correct of course

43:35
I mean you know I pre-qualify all of my

43:37
clients with my Underwriters I generally

43:40
will always be able to find a policy for

43:43
my clients you know the most common

43:47
chronic conditions can usually be underd

43:49
in

43:50
diabetes um you know

43:54
arthritis heart disease disase cancer

43:57
these types of issues if controlled are

44:00
fine for long-term care underwriting got

44:03
it what usually can trip people up is if

44:06
like Physical Therapy if they're

44:08
undergoing physical therapy

44:11
today we have to wait until the

44:13
therapy's completed and they're released

44:18
so sometimes it's just the timing issue

44:21
but generally speaking most people I can

44:23
get policies for but if somebody's

44:27
undergoing cancer treatment right now or

44:30
physical

44:32
therapy um things like that we're gonna

44:35
have to wait you know we're going to

44:38
have to wait um

44:42
so that that's it's a it's a process but

44:45
that actually turned into a good

44:47
question Jack I was I was I wasn't sure

44:49
but I I mean I learn every time I'm on

44:52
with you or I'm hanging out with you and

44:53
Jack was gracious enough to flying to

44:56
Vegas when I was the last time I was in

44:57
Vegas and we hung out a little bit I

44:59
learned things I learned things about

45:01
long-term care so that I can be a better

45:04
referral source for people that are

45:06
looking for that again ltcp partner.com

45:09
his name is Jack lindenberg as always do

45:12
Jack at the end of the and we've gone a

45:14
long time I'm looking at the clock I'm

45:15
like holy ma but as always do Jack I do

45:19
a mic drop moment where i' count it down

45:21
from five and then I hand over the mic

45:23
to you and you

45:26
at that point are going to say something

45:28
so incredible incredibly

45:31
insightful

45:33
smart and longlasting for the fans out

45:36
here that we're all going to be amazed

45:39
so no pressure at all oh Stan come on

45:42
here we go five four three two one

45:49
go come

45:51
on Stan is not a YouTu

45:54
fan that is

45:56
true and I did see them at theere I can

46:00
get is I I did see them at the the Las

46:02
Vegas sphere the other night with a good

46:05
with a good good friend and it was it

46:08
was forget the music that show's

46:12
amazing just the lights you did go I did

46:15
go I did go I'm not gonna tell anyone

46:18
what I pay for the tickets and all only

46:20
thing I can also tell people is when

46:21
you're buying tickets do not buy in

46:24
section 100 Buy in section

46:26
200 300 or the floor you will thank me

46:29
for that otherwise if you buy in

46:31
sectioned 100 you'll have an obstructive

46:34
view no I was not there but I was on the

46:37
floor real close to Bono because Bono

46:39
Bono that's that's barbecue Bono because

46:42
I'm you know I'm close to him Bono are

46:45
friends as you

46:47
know you didn't know that did

46:51
you listen Jack I was looking for

46:54
something insightful about finances

46:56
long-term care and you hit me with

46:58
YouTube which is good because then I had

47:00
to recover which is you know what the

47:02
commissioner does you know as I that's

47:04
my name for Jack the commish he's the

47:07
commissioner of everything long-term

47:09
care um Jack I really appreciate you

47:12
being on and I appreciate every single

47:14
person out there on all major podcast

47:16
platforms listening to this boy are we

47:19
growing and also watching us on the fun

47:22
with the nudies YouTube channel where

47:24
you see my midlife crisis happening Real

47:26
Time with some facial hair Jack it's my

47:29
wife's not thrilled about that you can

47:30
barely see it but it's coming going to

47:33
going to grow the gonna grow the annuity

47:36
goatee youthful it makes you look

47:39
young I don't know about that I don't

47:41
know about that listen thanks everybody

47:43
for joining us we'll see you next

47:49
time